Arcala

Mildly Menacing Medic
Contributor
Yes, I'm aware that this is controversial to post, and I'm sure it won't get any traction amongst Skial admins but here goes anyway!

I believe there is no reason for micspamming or using a soundboard to be punishable by muting and gagging, and here's a couple reasons why:

Number 1, TF2 has a built in mute function, and Skial Servers have the !ignore command. Players on the Skial servers already have ability to mute and gag people that they don't want to hear from without needing to report these players and add extra work onto the admins. This is something that is already being preached by the admins. This is an example that has been told to me , I wasn't here for these particular events, but recently there was a kid who was screaming and yelling and being generally obnoxious in the voice chat, and someone had started a votemute. The votemute failed and an admin had this to say:
1688577537964.png

What's the difference between the above situation and someone who micspams? Arguably there's nothing that separates the two aside from the content being played over the microphone, just use !ignore to mute the player playing music over the VC just like you would do so to mute an annoying kid screaming over VC. Alternatively you can even use the built in mute function in TF2 to mute these problem players yourself as well, though doing it this way prevents you from seeing their chat messages. This leads into my next point:

Number 2, users are able to votesilence. If it gets to a point where enough users are irritated, players have the ability to call a votesilence on a user for 30 minutes if the vote passes. Now ultimately doing this is pretty worthless when you have access to !ignore and the mute button, but it's still very much a valid option if a majority of players do not like what is being played, or if a particular user is crossing boundaries or being a nuisance.

Now I know what you might say next: "But Arcala, you only play on surf servers, you don't understand how that could affect servers like Payload or Casual where users need to be able to hear each other to coordinate pushes and call out spies!" That's a very valid point to bring up, but I would have to refer you back to my first paragraph: Ultimately you have your own power to mute these people, you don't have to listen to them if you don't want to. Skial and TF2 gives you the tools to curate your own playing experience. Let's talk about implementation for a moment, shall we? Despite everything I've talked about you may still be hesitant to allow micspamming on more serious servers like Casual and Payload, or even on something less serious like the Trade servers as micspamming can prevent people actively trying to set prices and advertise their wares. I also know that allowing exceptions to rules can be messy and a slippery slope if handled incorrectly, but I'd like to suggest making exceptions for servers where the feel of the game is already silly and fairly easy going. Servers that come to mind that are a great example of this are Zombie Escape, Death Run, Freak Fortress, Idle Trade, High Tower, 2Fort, and my favorite and home server: Surf.

In conclusion, I understand that micspamming isn't for everyone, but every user has the capability to curate their own player experience, whether that be through using !ignore, using the mute button that TF2 comes with natively, or votesilencing someone that the whole server disagrees with. Even if you don't allow micspamming on all servers, just a few, player retention should rise and the amount of reports admins need to respond to should fall, theoretically. I hope that I made a compelling argument for the inclusion of micspamming in Skial servers, and if not I hope that this was at least a decent read even if it may have been slightly rambly.

Regards,
Arcala
 

Stove™

Positively Inhumane Poster
The issue is almost ANYTHING can be labeled as spam or micspam. Talking to long in VC? Yeah I guess that's technically *mic-spam*. A 2 second sound effect on a soundboard, yelling, laughing, the list goes on.
You are desperately trying to stretch the definition here. If you're talking to the point that it's interrupting other people's conversations and nobody else can get a word in, yes, this is spam. Soundboards are inherently linked to micspam, and if you're going to play sounds constantly through that, you're obviously going to get muted. Music is in that same vain. It's distracting and annoying.

You can argue that someone plays a 2-second sound clip through their mic, doesn't do it again for the rest of the session, and it shouldn't be considered micspam. But pretty much all micspammers will play these sounds multiple times in their attempt at being funny, so why should the admins not stop it before it continues?

Once again, I'm a former micspammer. I can tell you the majority of people are annoyed by it which is why I stopped. Do you see the constant influx of reports coming in for micspam? Do you honestly believe that most people enjoy micspam if it's constantly getting reported?
 

Metroidz

Australian Skial God
Contributor
You guys are just refuting any arguments made against micspam.

You have made up your mind that you want to be able to micspam, while threads like these get shot down time and time again.
 
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Stove™

Positively Inhumane Poster
You guys are just refuting any arguments made against micspam.

You have made up your mind that you want to be able to micspam, while threads like these get shot down time and time again.
It feels like they've moved from trying to make a suggestion to just wanting to vent and argue about not being able to skirt the rules.
 
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Seminal Inhalation

Legendary Skial King
Contributor
You are desperately trying to stretch the definition here. If you're talking to the point that it's interrupting other people's conversations and nobody else can get a word in, yes, this is spam. Soundboards are inherently linked to micspam, and if you're going to play sounds constantly through that, you're obviously going to get muted. Music is in that same vain. It's distracting and annoying.

You can argue that someone plays a 2-second sound clip through their mic, doesn't do it again for the rest of the session, and it shouldn't be considered micspam. But pretty much all micspammers will play these sounds multiple times in their attempt at being funny, so why should the admins not stop it before it continues?

Once again, I'm a former micspammer. I can tell you the majority of people are annoyed by it which is why I stopped. Do you see the constant influx of reports coming in for micspam? Do you honestly believe that most people enjoy micspam if it's constantly getting reported?

They're not pro-micspam, they're anti-mod using pro-micspam as a safety blanket. Their in-game logs say it all.





SURF | US █████06/14/2023 - 06:54:25 PMLeglessare u trying to get 14 year old girls on yahoo news man

SURF | US █████06/14/2023 - 06:32:07 PMLeglessI AM BEING SURROUNDED BY LITTLE GREEN FLYING WITCHES GOING HEHEHEHE
SURF | US █████06/14/2023 - 06:31:55 PMLeglessAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
SURF | US █████06/14/2023 - 06:31:45 PMLeglessAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
SURF | US █████06/14/2023 - 06:31:41 PMLeglessAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA


--------

SURF | US █████07/05/2023 - 12:50:57 PMFreens :0Please +1 the post on the skial forms if you care about not being harassed by admins on this serve



SURF | US █████07/02/2023 - 09:01:46 AMFreens :0dont disrespect kalashnikov the all mighty



 

Freens

Mildly Menacing Medic
You are desperately trying to stretch the definition here. If you're talking to the point that it's interrupting other people's conversations and nobody else can get a word in, yes, this is spam. Soundboards are inherently linked to micspam, and if you're going to play sounds constantly through that, you're obviously going to get muted. Music is in that same vain. It's distracting and annoying.

You can argue that someone plays a 2-second sound clip through their mic, doesn't do it again for the rest of the session, and it shouldn't be considered micspam. But pretty much all micspammers will play these sounds multiple times in their attempt at being funny, so why should the admins not stop it before it continues?

Once again, I'm a former micspammer. I can tell you the majority of people are annoyed by it which is why I stopped. Do you see the constant influx of reports coming in for micspam? Do you honestly believe that most people enjoy micspam if it's constantly getting reported?
I honestly do not know if a majority of people are bothered by micspam because I dont play on every skial server. I only play on surf and my personal experience with micspammers there is that a vast majority of people are okay with it.

You can choose to look at how many micspam reports there are per day and think "wow, everyone must hate micspam", but you must also realize that there are likely an equal or greater amount of micspammers who are not reported that players had a positive interaction with.

Just because Friendly Killer reports 12 people per day out of a personal distaste for micspam doesn't mean that the entirety of the playerbase gets so annoyed that they believe it should constitute a month mute at times.

some =/ all

also "Music is in that same vain. It's distracting and annoying." Tf?
 

Legless

Unremarkable User
They're not pro-micspam, they're anti-mod using pro-micspam as a safety blanket. Their in-game logs say it all.





SURF | US █████06/14/2023 - 06:54:25 PMLeglessare u trying to get 14 year old girls on yahoo news man

SURF | US █████06/14/2023 - 06:32:07 PMLeglessI AM BEING SURROUNDED BY LITTLE GREEN FLYING WITCHES GOING HEHEHEHE
SURF | US █████06/14/2023 - 06:31:55 PMLeglessAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
SURF | US █████06/14/2023 - 06:31:45 PMLeglessAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
SURF | US █████06/14/2023 - 06:31:41 PMLeglessAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA


--------

SURF | US █████07/05/2023 - 12:50:57 PMFreens :0Please +1 the post on the skial forms if you care about not being harassed by admins on this serve



SURF | US █████07/02/2023 - 09:01:46 AMFreens :0dont disrespect kalashnikov the all mighty



Nothing of me in this is breaking the rules aside from your cataloguing of my first ever infraction on a skial server, which was having friendly killer votebanned. It wasn’t right, and it was against the rules, but it pretty well showed that 91% of players tend to agree with me on the subject, no?
 

Freens

Mildly Menacing Medic
They're not pro-micspam, they're anti-mod using pro-micspam as a safety blanket. Their in-game logs say it all.




SURF | US █████06/14/2023 - 06:54:25 PMLeglessare u trying to get 14 year old girls on yahoo news man

SURF | US █████06/14/2023 - 06:32:07 PMLeglessI AM BEING SURROUNDED BY LITTLE GREEN FLYING WITCHES GOING HEHEHEHE
SURF | US █████06/14/2023 - 06:31:55 PMLeglessAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
SURF | US █████06/14/2023 - 06:31:45 PMLeglessAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
SURF | US █████06/14/2023 - 06:31:41 PMLeglessAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA


--------

SURF | US █████07/05/2023 - 12:50:57 PMFreens :0Please +1 the post on the skial forms if you care about not being harassed by admins on this serve



SURF | US █████07/02/2023 - 09:01:46 AMFreens :0dont disrespect kalashnikov the all mighty



The only reason I am upset is because I have friends getting muted for spam without even using a soundboard. They were muted for using their voice in voice chat.

I don't understand how me mocking the admins decision to do this makes me want micspamming as a saftey blanket? lol

I have literally, never micspammed and have always been anti-micspamming-music.

UNRELATED CHAT SNIPS:



Why even include these? lmao

I was talking about some dude talking shit in chat in the first three and referring to a discord server in the last 3.
Completely unrelated.

the rest are all me just upset that my friend was muted for talking.
 

Legless

Unremarkable User
Bringing up player behavior outside of this topic is pretty much an ad hominem and isn’t relevant to the topic. I think the arguments we have made are valid, and just aren’t being considered by you, and still have not been addressed. All I see here is you treating us like we’re dumb, trolls, or rule breakers because we have a different stance on this issue. But I guess since you’re the ones in power, you can do that, right?
 

Freens

Mildly Menacing Medic
Its funny that Stove is the only one actually making arguments.
You guys are just refuting any arguments made against micspam.

You have made up your mind that you want to be able to micspam, while threads like these get shot down time and time again.

No shit we're refuting your points. That's what an argument is lmao
 
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BadmanoftheBrine

Banned
Contributor
Upon seeing this shit, with you louder lot basically screeching like I did on my first ban, I'm gonna unironically -1

I'd rather be permanently silenced than have to hear what you mong's would whine about
 

Freens

Mildly Menacing Medic
Upon seeing this shit, with you louder lot basically screeching like I did on my first ban, I'm gonna unironically -1

I'd rather be permanently silenced than have to hear what you mong's would whine about
Thats the cool part, you can just do !ignore.
 

Stove™

Positively Inhumane Poster
What about the rest of my post?
I honestly do not know if a majority of people are bothered by micspam because I dont play on every skial server. I only play on surf and my personal experience with micspammers there is that a vast majority of people are okay with it.
Multiple micspammers have been reported on 2Fort servers recently. I've also seen a couple of reports for Deathrun and Trade. Micspammers would also tend to get reported whenever I played in FF2. It doesn't matter if you don't play in all Skial servers; micspammers get reported across them all because it is annoying.
You can choose to look at how many micspam reports there are per day and think "wow, everyone must hate micspam", but you must also realize that there are likely an equal or greater amount of micspammers who are not reported that players had a positive interaction with.
You could also chalk this up to inherent laziness and people not feeling like putting in the effort to report those that are breaking the rules.
Just because Friendly Killer reports 12 people per day out of a personal distaste for micspam doesn't mean that the entirety of the playerbase gets so annoyed that they believe it should constitute a month mute at times.
Friendly Killer is clearly not the only one making these reports. If you searched through the reports for ones about micspam, there are more people than just Friendly Killer reporting this. Just because not every single person from these servers isn't reporting it doesn't mean that these same people aren't annoyed by the micspam.
some =/ all
I'm aware of this, but also, when did I say that "all people hate micspam"? I said "not everybody likes it" and "the majority of people hate it." There is a clear difference.

Again, this has derailed from being an actual suggestion to just being a vent post. Can we just decline this and move on?
 

Legless

Unremarkable User
Look, I am just a player of the skial surf server. I enjoy combat surf in tf2 and skial basically has a monopoly on it, so I play on skial surf. I still enjoy the game and my position on micspam is ultimately a small part of my experience. I’m just here to give my opinion on the topic. Think whatever you want or try to paint me and people with the same opinion as the enemy, but I’m just giving my position and I think it’s reasonable man