Abortion

Pro life or Pro choice?

  • Life

    Votes: 7 13.0%

  • Choice

    Votes: 47 87.0%
  • Total voters
    54
CDAWG said:
They chose to have sex. They have to live with the consequences of their choice. That is also true for abortion which, by the way, most women have emotional trauma after an abortion.
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They could have been having safe sex. Condoms, birth control, etc. Nothing but NOT HAVING SEX is 100% guarantee that you're not getting pregnant.
And yeah, emotional trauma. Have you ever heard of postpartum depression? Where a woman gets severely depressed after having a child? Does that not count for anything? To some women, the emotional 'trauma' of an abortion is worth it to not be FORCED INTO A PREGNANCY THAT YOU DO NOT WANT TO HAVE.
 
CDAWG said:
They chose to have sex. They have to live with the consequences of their choice. That is also true for abortion which, by the way, most women have emotional trauma after an abortion.
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A lot of women also have emotional trauma during a pregnancy.
Sex is a natural urge and you know that. The only reason more people aren't having sex at 15 is because people have "other means", albeit it still happens.
Condoms can break. People can be tricked. People can be raped. Pills might not work. It's all a game of luck and if you get the shitty end of the stick you should be able to make the decision to fix it.
 
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Sroy said:
I'm suprised no-one has brought up the childs point of view yet.

Should the child have to live with a depressed / abusive family? Should they have to go through the pain of feeling unwanted in an adoption centre?
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Should a child have to live with a mother who didn't want them in the first place? Should a child have to be pawned off to the state because their mother didn't want them? Have you ever been through foster care? Have you ever dealt with the baggage that comes with being told you were adopted? What if a woman wants to abort because she is dealing with a mental illness? An addiction? What if she is too poor to raise a family? What if she is COMPLETELY on her own with no family support or partner support?
 
Rhi said:
Should a child have to live with a mother who didn't want them in the first place? Should a child have to be pawned off to the state because their mother didn't want them? Have you ever been through foster care? Have you ever dealt with the baggage that comes with being told you were adopted?
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Exactly. That's why I dont have a real stance on abortion.

Sure, it's life, and the person having irresponsible sex should have consequences. However, I think the after-abortion depression and the relationship crumbling that comes with irresponsible sex is enough. The poor kid should not have to live through that.
 
Also, taken from another website:

It is so common for people, for example pro-lifers, to tell pregnant women who want an abortion, “Well, if you didn’t want a baby, you shouldn’t have had sex.”

But where are the people telling fathers who leave their kid’s lives because they don’t want to be a dad, “Well, if you didn’t want to be a dad, then you shouldn’t have had sex.”

Frankly, I find both statements to be wrong as sex isn’t solely for procreation, or else it wouldn’t feel good. And not all people can procreate, so what, they shouldn’t have sex if they are infertile? Sex is an act between two people who love each other, and want to share that love with each other. It does not have to have anything to do with making babies. Sex can also be used as a source of pleasure that can be obtained from anybody (one night stands, friends with benefits).

But if you tell a woman not to abort her baby because you think that consenting to sex means consenting to a baby (yeah only if she was silly enough to not use protection) but you don’t tell fathers who leave their baby mama’s and skip out on their kid’s lives, “well if you didn’t want to be a dad, you shouldn’t have stuck your penis in that vaginas.”

Both arguments are silly but at least don’t be double standarded as fuck. The misogyny and sexism towards women is disgusting. They are not your personal baby incubators, especially if you’re a stranger and you never met the woman. Forcing her to be a mother against her will is insensitive and only shows that you think women are just a womb and NOTHING more.
 
Besides, how is discussing this and getting mad at each other on a tf2 forum going to fix this?

For a friendly controversial table topic, sure it's fun but if you're sensitive about it you might want to not respond.
 
more to chew on:

A follower recently told me that “if you don’t want to get pregnant, you shouldn’t have sex.” I responded to this as part of a long comment on an extremely lengthy thread, but I wanted to repost just that part on its own.

"Your logic doesn’t work even slightly when applied to other situations. If you don’t want to get in a car accident, don’t get in a car! If you don’t want your house to burn down, don’t have electricity or fireplaces or woodburning stoves (actually you better just not have a house, because it could get struck by lighting no matter what precautions you take.)! If you don’t want to drown, don’t go swimming or go near any body of water ever!
But you know what? I don’t want to get in a car accident, but I do want to drive my car so I can get to work. I don’t want my house to burn down, but I want to use electricity so I can heat my home, see during the night, and power my sources of entertainment. I don’t want to drown, but I do want to go swimming/boating/kayaking/tubing because it’s fun. Right now, I don’t want to get pregnant, because if I did my life would be in great danger. But I do want to have sex with my husband, because it’s a healthy, natural, safe, and enjoyable way for me to physically express my love for him.
When I get in the car, I wear a seatbelt. When I light a fire in the fireplace, I make sure to put it out before going to bed, and I never leave it unattended. I also use grounded electrical sockets, surge protectors, etc. in my home. And when I go out on the lake or to a pool, I make sure that I am trained in how to swim, that there is a lifeguard nearby, or that I have a life vest on. When I have sex, I use two methods of contraception so that I won’t become pregnant until my body can handle it.”

People engage in risky behaviors every. single. day. If we didn’t do anything risky, we would do nothing at all. What we do, though, is take precautions and we make sure we have the ability to handle the consequences of our risks! We have fire departments, police, EMS, hospitals, insurance, and in the case of pregnancy…we have parenthood, abortion, and adoption.
 
Rhi, fathers who leave their children are universally looked down on, but I'm not going to argue any of your other points because I really see no reason to. We'll just end up repeating ourselves to each other and ignoring everything that the other side says; why bother? We're just beating a dead horse at this point, on page 4
 
Honestly this feels like a problem a little too big for us to fix, But heres the other side of my argument, the fetus isn't sentient now, having an abortion is the same as killing a tape worm, expect that tape worm might grow up to be a person and ether way would a kid who the parents wanted to abort really be brought up in the loving caring environment a kid needs, as opposed to waiting a few years for the parents to grow up.
 
Handsome Defibyoulater said:
It depends honestly.
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Ruelel said:
abortion is fine
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What they said. It mostly depends tbh. If you are 16 year old that wants to go to college or needs a diploma or something and this baby wasn't planned or will hold you back, then go for it. (or any reason similar to that in which the parent can't take care or handle a child)

I personally think that a baby is a human when they out and they are held in the hands of someone. Even though you may argue "how come babies can have their personality affected based on what you tell him/her things when he/she is in the womb", my response to that is it is just "seed" developing and they aren't actually alive.

I suppose its just as long as abortion doesn't turn into "put them down when their out of the womb". everyone is making a big deal out of this topic even a good portion of abortions happen because the parent is not in a good position to take care of a baby.


tl;dr
I agree with abortion. just really depends though, no one should just abort to abort.
 
Rhi said:
Also, taken from another website:

It is so common for people, for example pro-lifers, to tell pregnant women who want an abortion, “Well, if you didn’t want a baby, you shouldn’t have had sex.”

But where are the people telling fathers who leave their kid’s lives because they don’t want to be a dad, “Well, if you didn’t want to be a dad, then you shouldn’t have had sex.”

Frankly, I find both statements to be wrong as sex isn’t solely for procreation, or else it wouldn’t feel good. And not all people can procreate, so what, they shouldn’t have sex if they are infertile? Sex is an act between two people who love each other, and want to share that love with each other. It does not have to have anything to do with making babies. Sex can also be used as a source of pleasure that can be obtained from anybody (one night stands, friends with benefits).

But if you tell a woman not to abort her baby because you think that consenting to sex means consenting to a baby (yeah only if she was silly enough to not use protection) but you don’t tell fathers who leave their baby mama’s and skip out on their kid’s lives, “well if you didn’t want to be a dad, you shouldn’t have stuck your penis in that vaginas.”

Both arguments are silly but at least don’t be double standarded as fuck. The misogyny and sexism towards women is disgusting. They are not your personal baby incubators, especially if you’re a stranger and you never met the woman. Forcing her to be a mother against her will is insensitive and only shows that you think women are just a womb and NOTHING more.
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No one forced the woman to have sex. No one forced the man to have sex. Yes, fathers leave the babies. BUT, that is speculation. Let us looks at the facts. The life is created at conception. Every life should be allowed to live. Is that not in the Declaration of Independence? LIFE, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. What happened to life?
 
Avenger is right. The horse died on page 1.

My end opinion is: If you are not a woman, you should have no say on what is done with a womans body.
 
CDAWG said:
No one forced the woman to have sex. No one forced the man to have sex. Yes, fathers leave the babies. BUT, that is speculation. Let us looks at the facts. The life is created at conception. Every life should be allowed to live. Is that not in the Declaration of Independence? LIFE, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. What happened to life?
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"Facts" "...life is created at conception"

buddy, that's an opinion you got there.
 
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