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Staked le Steph

Mildly Menacing Medic
The EU server normally had 0 population so it isn't fair to assume that the server died just because it switched to Saxton Chaos. This is the population graph. It only started dropping once official was fixed and it dropped down to pre-summer levels.

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Saxton Chaos NY is having a hard time filling because of an IP change, summer vacation ending, and the regulars going on the server and continually spamming people about how bad it is and that they should all quit, as though that will convince me to change it back.

It really comes down to 2 choices and the choice was easy to make
  • Keep it on "vanilla" VSH, when the server is already clearly dying and is already empty entire days. It is easy to see it will die off completely in a matter of weeks.
  • Gamble on a remake with the chance to survive because it is vastly different and better than official.
I picked the gamble, because community VSH is clearly doomed. It is a waste of time to try and prolong it's death. There is absolutely no point in keeping a server around that only fills 1-2 hours a day if it even fills at all.
Keep the "Vanilla" vsh for a few weeks and see how it goes, and show results...
 

james bond

Somewhat Threatening Sniper
The last time the new server had any amount of players was nearly 3 weeks ago. Even compared to the "dying" stats of late August, where it still regularly filled at least once a day, this is much, much worse.
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Reverting vsh back to how it was before would I guess bring a few of the regulars back but the server would still slowely die off like the rest of the community vsh servers. So it would just be a waste of time and resources.
Skial could definitely have a version of VSH that's worth playing on, just like it does with other vanilla gamemodes, but a near-complete overhaul of it that alienates players isn't the way to do it.
 
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Bottiger

Administrator
The last time the new server had any amount of players was nearly 3 weeks ago. Even compared to the "dying" stats of late August, where it still regularly filled at least once a day, this is much, much worse.

Skial could definitely have a version of VSH that's worth playing on, just like it does with other vanilla gamemodes, but a near-complete overhaul of it that alienates players isn't the way to do it.

You're making 2 wrong assumptions.

1. If a server has 5 players max all day during summer vacation, it would be completely empty after summer vacation.

2. The server is empty now because of school, halloween update, and regulars are committed to boycotting it because they think it will force me to change it back. Even other vsh servers that changed nothing have 1/10th the players they used to have now.
 
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RockoRango

Somewhat Threatening Sniper
This whole thread is a genuinely funny read, appreciate it.

The amount of copium on both sides flying around is amazing. Shit is dead, it won’t be how it was, nobody wants to play this new shit.

Find something else to do.
I felt like returning to say I mostly agree with Xero, this thread is hilarious. The amount of copium from Bottiger and the community over the years has been tremendous but Bottiger always beat us out in terms of severity. To me it’s clear that Geiger expressed his concerns only for Bottiger to gaslight out his arse like usual.

The main reason regulars on VSH US, like myself, absolutely hate Bottiger is because he gaslights every regular who makes a legitimate argument for changes. He listens to some imaginary crowd of what he calls ‘regulars’ and then blamed the actual, dedicated regulars for the server’s problems. Out of my nearly 10 years of playing US day after day and making most of my friends from it, there hasn’t been one day where an actual regular has said “Bottiger and me discussed some changes and wasn’t gaslighting me the entire time” other than Mub (who left because you would deny any changes the community usually agreed with).

Case and point: Cinema. Nearly every, not all, but a majority, veteran and regular said that cinema was killing player retention. We said it on the forums, the discord, basically everywhere, and you response was “Then stop voting for it 4head, the statistics say otherwise”. You ignored the constant feedback for the sake of players who didn’t enjoy VSH; You sacrificed the dedicated playerbase for players who only enjoyed Cinema.

VSH is dead, and you killed it. There’s no going back from it, we’ll all deal with it and move on. Maybe if your ego wasn’t inflated you’d have listened to any sort of feedback you didn’t agree with or you’d admit you made major mistakes that resulted in the server’s death. Either way, what’s done is done. Good job!
 
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Bottiger

Administrator
I felt like returning to say I mostly agree with Xero, this thread is hilarious. The amount of copium from Bottiger and the community over the years has been tremendous but Bottiger always beat us out in terms of severity. To me it’s clear that Geiger expressed his concerns only for Bottiger to gaslight out his arse like usual.

If you still think that I am mostly to blame for killing the server despite the mountain of evidence suggesting otherwise... you are the one that is delusional, and quite simply, stupid.

Every single community vsh server has either died out completely or vastly reduced player counts. It has nothing to do with me and more to do with the fact that official vsh is killing them all due to getting more players from preferential placement in the game menu.

This is the most populated one, now empty for most of the day and never gets over half when it does fill.

bw.png


Here's another one that was supposed to replace us. It was endorsed by disgruntled regs such as yourself. They supposedly always do whatever the players tell them to do and never make "bad changes" like me. It's completely empty 99% of the time.

https://www.battlemetrics.com/servers/tf2/22741428?playerCount=3M
I accepted almost every single change mub made, and even got blamed for a lot of them.

vagineer uber

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fixing crits on bosses so eggs crit again

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me not thinking gspy is good for the server

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making airblast cost more ammo

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All of these things people were bitching at me about when I didn't want to add them. But I did it anyway because he was supposed to be in charge of the game mode and I honestly don't have time to manage all 9+ game modes we have.

You also need to ask yourself why his own server died if he was so much better than me at balancing.

Case and point: Cinema. Nearly every, not all, but a majority, veteran and regular said that cinema was killing player retention. We said it on the forums, the discord, basically everywhere, and you response was “Then stop voting for it 4head, the statistics say otherwise”. You ignored the constant feedback for the sake of players who didn’t enjoy VSH; You sacrificed the dedicated playerbase for players who only enjoyed Cinema.

Case in point, this is another shining example of why the average vsh reg is stupid, and if you were in charge of running the server, it would have died out a long time ago like countless others.

You have 0 proof that it killed the server while there was every indication that more players liked it than hated it. The FF2 server is running it and it's not dying.

Out of all the servers we run, many of the VSH regs (not all of them of course) are among the worst. You think you know better, but you don't. Even when the evidence is right in your face.
 

Staked le Steph

Mildly Menacing Medic
changes are so bad it feels like its intentional, most of us just want a normal vsh experience.
"saxton chaos" was the final straw for me. i dont get the point of this gamemode anymore.
storms, revives, i feel like i play fortnite again
it feels like a 12 year old made this to make the game easier for him instead of getting good
Yeah I agree.

Every time after school I just get on tf2, then play vsh skial until I was bored as I had fun with the many people of skial vsh like the goofy strats that Canadian spaghetti does, to seeing clutches or a telefrag on hale. Having the challenge to play as hale with many players of variation of skills of known players to complete newcomers and regulars but now I can't have none of that fun ever since that update.

Anybody that i had fun with which were just people I know are cool in the skial community just disappear..

Saxton Chaos was only active for like 1 month until it just died occasionally having 1 person atleast once every 2 weeks.

I just felt speechless about the update when I heard about it as you would never see a medic clutches or something that could end with celebration..

And here we are in 2024 (as im writing this) yet nothing has been done.
 

SIS

Uncharitable Spy
the removal of skial vsh has made me lose my only motivation in life, i do not know if i can carry on with life when i have to bare this burden. I will spend all of my life savings on random thrift store items to combat this.
 

herp 105.4

Rage-Inducing Forum Troll
Contributor
FF2 Balancer
the removal of skial vsh has made me lose my only motivation in life, i do not know if i can carry on with life when i have to bare this burden. I will spend all of my life savings on random thrift store items to combat this.
damn thats so sad can i get your +1 for turret testing