Declined Sort out your ban system

[hr]

There was a guy in EU dustbowl 1 today spamming trade binds. I told him to stop, he did it more. I made a ban request it got 80% yes and it failed to meet the 90% requirement. He then decides to post one about me simply for making the one against him (accusing me of racism) but instead uses the mute function so it only needs 70%, of course it passes. He then decides to taunt me constantly through the chat and tells people I'm a hacker to which I cannot defend myself. This happens every time anyone makes any kind of these ban requests, no-one reads them and the majority of players will vote yes for anything but not so many that any kind of ban ever usually happens yet every time someone gets mad and blindly calls a vote on me usually because they think I'm a hacker it gets 50 - 70%.

Get rid of this system and make it so that only 'trusted' players can call and respond to votes. My system for this would be to use something like your AP except it shouldn't rely on being in some steam group, with points being earned by playing and lost by getting banned or muted or regularly voting against the winning vote (i.e players with 1000 points+ can vote and no-one else). Abuse of the system would mean a ban from being 'trusted'. Or maybe this sucks and you need something else but it's terrible as it is right now.

As for the guy today it's this guy http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198118604784
http://cloud-4.steampowered.com/ugc/544135968731757959/E1A0D5680B11F2874B6C2D1A2C34C62392824D85/

 

[Sir Gooch P Tigglington]

Then why does votemenu exist? As I've said the amount of times it is abused makes it not worth having, just get rid of it and only have the report system

If you have such a problem with the votemenu system then just use the report system. This is exactly why we have multiple avenues for players to address their grievances. Just stop posting, your suggestion is dumb and nothing will come from it.

 

[Bottiger]

Why do we have vote-based moderation? Because it works most of the time and is faster and easier than waiting for an admin to come.

Just like you are too lazy to report vote abuse, most people are too lazy to report to an admin.

If it was as bad as you say, no one would ever tolerate Valve servers. Last time I checked, our voting thresholds were even higher.

No one is ever going to have enough admins to police every server 24/7.

Get rid of this system and make it so that only 'trusted' players can call and respond to votes. My system for this would be to use something like your AP except it shouldn't rely on being in some steam group, with points being earned by playing and lost by getting banned or muted or regularly voting against the winning vote (i.e players with 1000 points+ can vote and no-one else). Abuse of the system would mean a ban from being 'trusted'. Or maybe this sucks and you need something else but it's terrible as it is right now.

We already have something like this. It is called the voting cooldown which can be eliminated with enough AP. If someone abuses the votemenu, then they get it disabled and become muted.

As for requiring being in our Steam group, that's just something you're going to have to live with.

This system has been in place and refined for the past 5 years and everything you suggested has already been considered long ago.

 

[hr]

If you have such a problem with the votemenu system then just use the report system. This is exactly why we have multiple avenues for players to address their grievances. Just stop posting, your suggestion is dumb and nothing will come from it.

Don't call it dumb if you don't even read what it is I'm saying. It's bad because of it banning innocent people more than it's bad because one can't get people who deserve to be banned, banned. If I only use the report system that doesn't change that.
I will stop posting as clearly this isn't going to go anywhere but I find it somewhat amusing that people are willing to defend this system so heavily when it is clearly so flawed. Perhaps it is the best thing you've come up with and perhaps you don't see how bad it is given that no-one has or could have any statistics on how effective it is (ratio of deserved to non deserved bans).

Just like you are too lazy to report vote abuse, most people are too lazy to report to an admin.

I'd be more than happy to use !report but I don't see why I should be required to open a webpage because I've been silenced inappropriately, the whole process of that is likely to take maybe 10 mins maybe more when the silence itself is what 30 mins?

 

[Genocide]

Don't call it dumb if you don't even read what it is I'm saying. It's bad because of it banning innocent people more than it's bad because one can't get people who deserve to be banned, banned. If I only use the report system that doesn't change that.
I will stop posting as clearly this isn't going to go anywhere but I find it somewhat amusing that people are willing to defend this system so heavily when it is clearly so flawed. Perhaps it is the best thing you've come up with and perhaps you don't see how bad it is given that no-one has or could have any statistics on how effective it is (ratio of deserved to non deserved bans).

I'd be more than happy to use !report but I don't see why I should be required to open a webpage because I've been silenced inappropriately, the whole process of that is likely to take maybe 10 mins maybe more when the silence itself is what 30 mins?

Ever considered that perhaps people silence you because you are completely annoying? Just a thought.

 

[hr]

Ever considered that perhaps people silence you because you are completely annoying? Just a thought.

Hilarious and very mature. But no I don't speak on the mic or chat for the most of the time unless I'm replying to someone.

 

[Bottiger]

It is really simple. You think that abuse happens all the time. It doesn't.

Just because it happened to you 1 or 2 times doesn't mean it happens all the time.

The votemenu solves a lot more problems than it causes. If there's 1 person being slightly inconvenienced for every 20 legitimate bans, then that's a trade-off we'll take.

 

[Deadfront]

Hilarious and very mature. But no I don't speak on the mic or chat for the most of the time unless I'm replying to someone.

Nice job trying to pose as a admin...

 

[Meowrisa]

Nice job trying to pose as a admin...

If I remember that's a bannable offense...
winkwink

Seriously, maybe the silence was justified.
Just further proving our system works.

 

[hr]

If I remember that's a bannable offense...
winkwink

Seriously, maybe the silence was justified.
Just further proving our system works.

Depends how one chooses to interpret the rules, I'm not impersonating anyone I simply state that I have admin which isn't true and it was hardly a real attempt to convince anyone. However this has already been posted and it's irrelevant to the point I was making, is it immature? Perhaps it is but I'm not attacking anyone's character in here and yet everyone feels the need to attack mine because they disagree with my argument, very few people are posting real arguments as to why my idea would not work or why they feel like the system is good as is.

 

[Deadfront]

So you saying that was not impersonating an admin? You talking like this is what gets you muted, not because the system is flawed. You are just mad because you were caught and couldn't pass your vote as retaliation.

 

[hr]

So you saying that was not impersonating an admin? You talking like this is what gets you muted, not because the system is flawed. You are just mad because you were caught and couldn't pass your vote as retaliation.

That was not why I was muted but I'll agree that it doesn't give me much evidence to support my argument. My experience over a long time watching many votes of different people and looking at the percentages is what has formed my opinion on the system and it is almost always over 50% no matter what the player no matter what the offense. Also looking at the text chat from one side really doesn't show you the picture, I could send the demo but it wouldn't get us any further.

 

[Deadfront]

That was not why I was muted but I'll agree that it doesn't give me much evidence to support my argument. My experience over a long time watching many votes of different people and looking at the percentages is what has formed my opinion on the system and it is almost always over 50% no matter what the player no matter what the offense. Also looking at the text chat from one side really doesn't show you the picture, I could send the demo but it wouldn't get us any further.

My problem is you are asking us to change things all the while you are breaking rules. It just doesn't help your cause at all. While no system is perfect this one has been very effective and will stay in effect because of it. I wish you luck and as admin would be willing to help you if you just ask.

 

[hr]

My problem is you are asking us to change things all the while you are breaking rules. It just doesn't help your cause at all. While no system is perfect this one has been very effective and will stay in effect because of it.

I believe that the system just doesn't show it's flaws rather than being very effective. I understand changes like these are not easy to implement but it seems like everyone was very quick to dismiss any problems before any 'rule breaking' was even mentioned. Perhaps I've gone about this in the wrong way focusing on an incident involving myself in which I do indeed act immaturely however I don't feel like that should be used to define the point. I'd offer to amass some evidence but alas I think getting enough data to show my point might take a very long time.

 

[Sheev_Palpatine]

1. Use !votemenu
2. If that don't work, make a manual report on Skial
3. If that don't work, add a few admins to your friends list
4. ???
5. Profit