Declined [FF2] Remove SMG's guaranteed critical hits

chairius✿

chairius✿

Wicked Nasty Engineer
FF2 Balancer
Title. Annoying to fight against as hale; critical hit knockback is very powerful for keeping hale away, and on a rapid fire weapon it is abysmal to combat. Whilst superjumping they can push you very far with just a few shots, so you can imagine 35 shots in a clip on a weapon that fires very quickly is awful. Not only is it painful to fight against, but it currently overshadows all of the other sniper's secondary weapons. Sniper is already powerful enough with his current toolkit and does not need a weapon as powerful as this to help him.
 
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herp 105.4

herp 105.4

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chairius✿ said:
35 shots
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25 and also keep in mind that barely anyone uses the smg
the razorback and the dds completely outclass it with the ability of taking another hit
not only that but it is way more reliable than the sniper rifle WHICH can also stop the super jump
all in all; no it doesnt outdamage the main weapon, no it doesnt guarantee your safety and no it isnt better than the razorback and dds
 
chairius✿

chairius✿

Wicked Nasty Engineer
FF2 Balancer
herp 105.4 said:
25 and also keep in mind that barely anyone uses the smg
the razorback and the dds completely outclass it with the ability of taking another hit
not only that but it is way more reliable than the sniper rifle WHICH can also stop the super jump
all in all; no it doesnt outdamage the main weapon, no it doesnt guarantee your safety and no it isnt better than the razorback and dds
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Knockback crits. read the original post before blindly -1'ing because i'm trying to undo your changes. I never said it outdamages it; it still deals quite a lot of damage but does not outdamage a Huntsman or Sniper Rifle.
The sniper rifle can slow it down with a single shot yes, but that implies you actually hit the shot, and most moderately skilled snipers cannot even hit a flying hale with a Sniper Rifle easily, especially clear with a Huntsman. The SMG has a large spread with a lot of room for error, two or three shots is all it will take to completely stop a hale's jump.
Razorback and DD's have a very similar effect, it will tank a single hale hit. This is good in concept but on paper it is quite bad, as there is no invincibility after being hit, so the hale can just hit you again after hitting you once. This is only good for Huntsman shenanigans as you can entrap the hale in a taunt kill easily with these items. The knockback is much more likely to save you than being able to tank a single hit.
25 shots is still a lot.
 
herp 105.4

herp 105.4

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chairius✿ said:
Knockback crits. read the original post before blindly -1'ing because i'm trying to undo your changes. I never said it outdamages it; it still deals quite a lot of damage but does not outdamage a Huntsman or Sniper Rifle.
The sniper rifle can slow it down with a single shot yes, but that implies you actually hit the shot, and most moderately skilled snipers cannot even hit a flying hale with a Sniper Rifle easily, especially clear with a Huntsman. The SMG has a large spread with a lot of room for error, two or three shots is all it will take to completely stop a hale's jump.
Razorback and DD's have a very similar effect, it will tank a single hale hit. This is good in concept but on paper it is quite bad, as there is no invincibility after being hit, so the hale can just hit you again after hitting you once. This is only good for Huntsman shenanigans as you can entrap the hale in a taunt kill easily with these items. The knockback is much more likely to save you than being able to tank a single hit.
25 shots is still a lot.
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as one of the fucking 3 people who use the smg, after a 10 minute round 1 time the max damage i got was 4.5k which is good damage so yeah
the razorback and the dds allow for something better than the smg; strafe hitting which is arguably stronger than the smg
also the knockback isnt even something to cry home about. sure it can slow a jump but thats it
not broken, not game breaking but a good mechanic which is rewarding
 
chairius✿

chairius✿

Wicked Nasty Engineer
FF2 Balancer
♥Flandre♥ said:
-1
hales has more hp If smg got removed crits and he can kill you.
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use your sniper rifle to deal damage instead of your smg? I don't understand what you're trying to say.

herp 105.4 said:
as one of the fucking 3 people who use the smg, after a 10 minute round 1 time the max damage i got was 4.5k which is good damage so yeah
the razorback and the dds allow for something better than the smg; strafe hitting which is arguably stronger than the smg
also the knockback isnt even something to cry home about. sure it can slow a jump but thats it
not broken, not game breaking but a good mechanic which is rewarding
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Once again, never said anything about the SMG being good for damage, that was never an issue I had with it. The Razorback does not allow you to strafe after being hit, but the DD does, which I admit is a very valuable skill to learn, but I don't quite think it outclasses the knockback from the SMG.
Slowing a jump can be the difference of life or death for a sniper, its a large portion of why the critical hits should be removed. They're annoying to fight against and make sniper an extremely easy class to play to get high damage. I would say an experienced sniper could rack up more damage than a spy only because of the critical knockback the SMG allows. It makes it pointless to shoot hales out of the sky with the sniper rifle anymore. Also, why use the Cozy Camper? Its a complete downgrade considering its SMG has no critical hits and all of the upsides of the Cozy Camper have no effect in FF2.
 
herp 105.4

herp 105.4

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FF2 Balancer
chairius✿ said:
use your sniper rifle to deal damage instead of your smg? I don't understand what you're trying to say.


Once again, never said anything about the SMG being good for damage, that was never an issue I had with it. The Razorback does not allow you to strafe after being hit, but the DD does, which I admit is a very valuable skill to learn, but I don't quite think it outclasses the knockback from the SMG.
Slowing a jump can be the difference of life or death for a sniper, its a large portion of why the critical hits should be removed. They're annoying to fight against and make sniper an extremely easy class to play to get high damage. I would say an experienced sniper could rack up more damage than a spy only because of the critical knockback the SMG allows. It makes it pointless to shoot hales out of the sky with the sniper rifle anymore. Also, why use the Cozy Camper? Its a complete downgrade considering its SMG has no critical hits and all of the upsides of the Cozy Camper have no effect in FF2.
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if we removed everything "annoying" then most reds wont have a way to defend themselves. it is one of the few tools sniper has to give him a fighting chance of survival. also you fucking know a sniper cannot out-damage a spy with the smg because 1 backstab on average is over 3k damage and on bosses like chaddiger its 6k so no. also cozy camper has bleed knockback which is quite good because its a continuous knockback
 
soos

soos

TF2 Admin
♥Flandre♥ said:
I'm just saying that smg is fine to me.
but sometimes smg has no crits on each arena round.
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this is only a thing when the map changes, its the “pre-game” as some people call it, its purpose is to let people load in before starting the actual game mode. its the base game, so there arent krits on the smg and other weapons.
 
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