Need Supporters Have the baby face blaster and boston basher block healing in VSH

Dragontamer

Dragontamer

TF2 Admin
Contributor
Being a scout, it's annoying to get healed by medics every 5 seconds when you're trying to do the boston basher + baby face blaster combo (hit yourself twice so you shoot faster) so it ruins your chance to use rapid fire with it. If both weapons could block healing that would be great for the combo.
 
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True Darkian

True Darkian

Wicked Nasty Engineer
Contributor
+1

Very annoying, and if I ask to stop, that Medic either won't listen, becomes a pocket medic just for me, or I get 3 extra pocket medics next round.

BFB and Boston Basher should block all healing from dispensers, mediguns, amputators and crossbows.
 
bl0

bl0

Positively Inhumane Poster
Contributor
Isn't the BFB blaster considered pretty op once you obtain full boost against Hale. You could just run around in circles all day if it blocked healing.
 
True Darkian

True Darkian

Wicked Nasty Engineer
Contributor
bl0 said:
Isn't the BFB blaster considered pretty op once you obtain full boost against Hale. You could just run around in circles all day if it blocked healing.
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The current state of the BFB:
* 6 shell capacity.
* The lower the health, the higher the fire rate and spread.
* Boost reduced on double jump.
* Boost decays at a fast rate, you'll only stay fast with constant hits.
* Reduced health from health packs.
* -25 Max health.

Medics healing BFB either have no idea or are trolling them.
BFB Scouts lose their boost very fast, they need to make constant hits, which the low HP fire rate helps with it, but then Medics heal them, making the fire rate low again.

I've been teamkilled by Medics quite alot because they took away my low HP fire rate where I couldn't keep my speed up to where hale kills me.
 
Brimp

Brimp

Somewhat Threatening Sniper
I feel like this should stay the way it is because when you have this combo equipped its very frustrating as hale to kill the scout when he doesn't have rage and is that last one left, especially on open maps like dust, urban, and toys where there is almost no room to super jump against a ceiling to drop down quicker. If I could change anything to it is that I would remove the lower the health the faster you shoot and spread is increased because this is just a very unfair and unfun strategy to play against.
 
Dragontamer

Dragontamer

TF2 Admin
Contributor
The baby face blaster is in no way overpowered. Before the sandman was nerfed it was pretty easy for scouts to escape Hale and no one was crying for nerfs at the time.

Being at 20 health requires scouts to be very careful with their double jumps, as a quick fall can easily kill them. Hale can also use rage on the scouts, that's one of the easiest ways for him to kill any class. The whole reason people play scout on vsh is for his good mobility to escape Hale, which is also what the bfb rewards. Also, in order to get a boost the scout has to be up close to Hale, and being careless can get you killed pretty fast. The boost doesn't last long either. Ammo is also another thing that gets chewed up pretty quickly. There's only so much ammo you can get until you're the last one alive as scout, almost leaving you defenseless against Hale.

bl0 said:
Best way to waste time for everyone, equip the bfb.
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If you think this is true, then you have not seen Pyro. He can airblast Hale and can flare jump anywhere you wanted at a low cost with no risks. When I was Hale one time, a game was dragged on way to long because there was a Pyro who just camped on a mountain with a demo and kept airblasting me off. Each time I raged he either airblasted me before the stun hit him or when he went off the mountain the demo came in and launched me away with his grenade launcher, allowing the pyro to flare jump back up. So no, Pyro is the one that actually wastes time.
 
bl0

bl0

Positively Inhumane Poster
Contributor
Dragontamer said:
The baby face blaster is in no way overpowered. Before the sandman was nerfed it was pretty easy for scouts to escape Hale and no one was crying for nerfs at the time.

Being at 20 health requires scouts to be very careful with their double jumps, as a quick fall can easily kill them. Hale can also use rage on the scouts, that's one of the easiest ways for him to kill any class. The whole reason people play scout on vsh is for his good mobility to escape Hale, which is also what the bfb rewards. Also, in order to get a boost the scout has to be up close to Hale, and being careless can get you killed pretty fast. The boost doesn't last long either. Ammo is also another thing that gets chewed up pretty quickly. There's only so much ammo you can get until you're the last one alive as scout, almost leaving you defenseless against Hale.


If you think this is true, then you have not seen Pyro. He can airblast Hale and can flare jump anywhere you wanted at a low cost with no risks. When I was Hale one time, a game was dragged on way to long because there was a Pyro who just camped on a mountain with a demo and kept airblasting me off. Each time I raged he either airblasted me before the stun hit him or when he went off the mountain the demo came in and launched me away with his grenade launcher, allowing the pyro to flare jump back up. So no, Pyro is the one that actually wastes time.
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Feral Angel

Feral Angel

TF2 Admin
Contributor
Dragontamer said:
So no, Pyro is the one that actually wastes time.
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Not true, soldier can be really annoying too if he does nothing but jump around the map stalling the round. Been there and done that, when a solly knows it can’t hut hale he just keeps jumping around.

BFB scout can be very op. Yea I agree with what you said but there’s scout mains out there that know how to play so well it makes it very difficult for the hale to get the scout. With the speed + knockback he can overrun the hale really quick. Plus inexperienced hales have waaaaaay to much difficulty getting scouts that op. Also they tend to be treaty with being single raged and know how to get away or when to stay on a platform the hale missed to land. So I think you’re kinda being a little dramatic about how difficult it is to play scout with bfb. You guys already have it easy as I said before with the speed and the knockback.
 
Dragontamer

Dragontamer

TF2 Admin
Contributor
Feral Angel said:
Not true, soldier can be really annoying too if he does nothing but jump around the map stalling the round. Been there and done that, when a solly knows it can’t hut hale he just keeps jumping around.

BFB scout can be very op. Yea I agree with what you said but there’s scout mains out there that know how to play so well it makes it very difficult for the hale to get the scout. With the speed + knockback he can overrun the hale really quick. Plus inexperienced hales have waaaaaay to much difficulty getting scouts that op. Also they tend to be treaty with being single raged and know how to get away or when to stay on a platform the hale missed to land. So I think you’re kinda being a little dramatic about how difficult it is to play scout with bfb. You guys already have it easy as I said before with the speed and the knockback.
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Inexperienced Hales can have problems with spies and market garden soldiers also. Sure, maybe nerf the bfb to 4 shots but that should be made in a different thread. The point of this suggestion is to block healing from medics so you can actually make use of the combo, not a suggestion for nerfing the bfb. If you think that avoiding medics, who are your teammates, is a good idea to balance it out then that's a terrible idea.

Also, there's a low chance that scouts will be using this combo, as I mostly see them using the scattergun or the force and nature. Even then, 1/4 of the scouts usually will be using it.
 
bl0

bl0

Positively Inhumane Poster
Contributor
Feral Angel said:
Not true, soldier can be really annoying too if he does nothing but jump around the map stalling the round. Been there and done that, when a solly knows it can’t hut hale he just keeps jumping around.

BFB scout can be very op. Yea I agree with what you said but there’s scout mains out there that know how to play so well it makes it very difficult for the hale to get the scout. With the speed + knockback he can overrun the hale really quick. Plus inexperienced hales have waaaaaay to much difficulty getting scouts that op. Also they tend to be treaty with being single raged and know how to get away or when to stay on a platform the hale missed to land. So I think you’re kinda being a little dramatic about how difficult it is to play scout with bfb. You guys already have it easy as I said before with the speed and the knockback.
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How to waste time with this simple recipe.

militaryvsh_military_area_b1 + Soldier + Mantreads + Liberty Launcher + Market Gardener
 
Percilius

Percilius

Totally Ordinary Human
Contributor
FF2 Balancer
-1
This is probably the most op combo the scout has in his arsenal in VSH. From past experiences most of the people who use the bfb and boston basher usually pair it up with a crit a cola and this makes it nearly impossible for the hale to out manouver the scout as his jump would be nullified with the constant number of shots the scout can hit at him at low health. The only way to kill even a decent bfb scout would mostly be through raging. The combo is starting to become more common now than when it was first re added.
 
Dragontamer

Dragontamer

TF2 Admin
Contributor
Droplet said:
-1
This is probably the most op combo the scout has in his arsenal in VSH. From past experiences most of the people who use the bfb and boston basher usually pair it up with a crit a cola and this makes it nearly impossible for the hale to out manouver the scout as his jump would be nullified with the constant number of shots the scout can hit at him at low health. The only way to kill even a decent bfb scout would mostly be through raging. The combo is starting to become more common now than when it was first re added.
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It may be an OP combo, but that's why I said to suggest nerfs. Now matter how overpowered a combo is, a class should never get punished using it by his own teammate.
 
Percilius

Percilius

Totally Ordinary Human
Contributor
FF2 Balancer
Dragontamer said:
It may be an OP combo, but that's why I said to suggest nerfs. Now matter how overpowered a combo is, a class should never get punished using it by his own teammate.
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Try thinking of the negative effects this would have on the medic.
Imagine a medic being trapped in a corner and would try to heal you to get a speed boost and escape from the boss but can't because you're using the bfb and it has healing disabled.
Sure that might not be a common scenario you would see on VSH but if you're suggesting a fix to people healing you, you should think about it both ways.
He needs to get Uber when there's 2 people left but you have those weapons disabling healing hence making him try to go on the attack to get Uber or he'd mindlessly be running away as much as possible and eventually would end up dying.
There are possibly many more ways this can affect him.
Best option is try to ignore him if he really is being a nuisance. You've got the mobility to easily do so and it takes you only 2-3 hits to get low on health again so for the shit tons of damage that you can potentially deal, I'm sure an annoying medic can count as a compensation to not make it as overpowered of a weapon combo all the time.
 
Cream Tea

Cream Tea

Epic Skial Regular
Legendary Mapper
it definitely used to be disabled years ago I guess it got re-enabled when the bfb got changed because they didn't think it would be as op.

I'm talking vsh 1.42 here
 
True Darkian

True Darkian

Wicked Nasty Engineer
Contributor
Wasn't there also a +10% Damage bonus on the BFB? That could be removed, and maybe lower spare ammo since BFB Scouts almost always need to find more ammo.
 
Sargent¥

Sargent¥

Australian Skial God
Contributor
This doesn't sound right. These 2 weapons weren't designed to be a combo so, honestly, it shouldn't be a combo. I think meds stopping it, whether it's intentional or not, is a good thing. Maneuvering against hale should be a skill, not a "I hurt myself, do small but accurate (and therefore consistent) damage to refill my boost, now I go vroom vroom quick, come get me Hale". To me, that just sounds like it's either going to stall the round by either chipping at Hale extremely slowly or the Scout just outrunning him.

I don't play Hale so I don't know the analytics behind it but hypothetically, it doesn't sound fun for Hale or for people waiting for the round to end.
 
Dragontamer

Dragontamer

TF2 Admin
Contributor
Droplet said:
Try thinking of the negative effects this would have on the medic.
Imagine a medic being trapped in a corner and would try to heal you to get a speed boost and escape from the boss but can't because you're using the bfb and it has healing disabled.
Sure that might not be a common scenario you would see on VSH but if you're suggesting a fix to people healing you, you should think about it both ways.
He needs to get Uber when there's 2 people left but you have those weapons disabling healing hence making him try to go on the attack to get Uber or he'd mindlessly be running away as much as possible and eventually would end up dying.
There are possibly many more ways this can affect him.
Best option is try to ignore him if he really is being a nuisance. You've got the mobility to easily do so and it takes you only 2-3 hits to get low on health again so for the shit tons of damage that you can potentially deal, I'm sure an annoying medic can count as a compensation to not make it as overpowered of a weapon combo all the time.
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That's why you use your secondary to allow the medic to heal you. Even with the crit-a-cola you could just make the bfb block healing, not the boston basher.
Sargent¥ said:
This doesn't sound right. These 2 weapons weren't designed to be a combo so, honestly, it shouldn't be a combo.
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I don't understand your point here. I'm pretty sure the battalion's backup wasn't meant to be used as a combo with the Zatoichi and direct hit, yet it is still being used by soldiers, which doesn't need something that takes up your secondary slot (although the pistol on vsh is pretty bad anyways) and simply needs a taunt to boost the meter to full in three hits.

Even if these two weren't meant to be a combo, let's say the boston basher was removed. Scouts could just jump and take some fall damage until they're low enough to use rapid fire.
Sargent¥ said:
I don't play Hale so I don't know the analytics behind it but hypothetically, it doesn't sound fun for Hale or for people waiting for the round to end.
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I play as Hale when I get the chance and whenever I see scouts using this combo their an easy kill using either rage or just using the super jump to get to them really quick.
 
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